True English

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Re: True English

Message  gerardM le Ven 10 Nov - 22:00

> "We had a ball today!", which puzzled me.

"Puzzle" doesn't have the same meaning in English and in French.

What the French call "puzzle" is a "jigsaw puzzle".
In En a puzzle is:
- a mystery
- a game with a bit of difficulty e.g. crossword puzzle, jigsaw puzzle

-- "to puzzle" means a bit more than to surprise (Fr déconcerter)
-- "to puzzle over" means to think (in order to understand)
-- "to puzzle out something/to puzzle something out" means to guess

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Re: True English

Message  MurielB le Ven 10 Nov - 23:22

Gérard "to have the time of our lives" could also translate "to have a ball". "To enjoy ourselves" very much is far too common isn't it ?

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Re: True English

Message  gerardM le Sam 11 Nov - 0:59

Yes Muriel, there are -such as in French- lots of possible expressions.

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Re: True English

Message  MurielB le Sam 11 Nov - 21:09

Gérard a écrit:-- "to puzzle" means a bit more than to surprise (Fr déconcerter)
-- "to puzzle over" means to think (in order to understand)
-- "to puzzle out something/to puzzle something out" means to guess

il like "chassés croisés" (when we translate English phrasal verbs into French the English postposition is the French verb and the verb is the phrase of manner ). here puzzle is the phrase of manner
To puzzle over =>faire très attention en se posant des questions
To puzzle out=>sortir quelque chose en se posant des questions;
Do you think my explanation is far-fetched ?

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Re: True English

Message  gerardM le Dim 3 Déc - 18:16

... not the first time I meet this in English: a different pronunciation to distinguish the noun from the verb
Associate as a noun doesn't have the same pronunciation as as a verb (a diphtong for the verb) - LOL see the earphone icons? I can play them Smile


"Big" difference b/w the noun breath and the verb to breathe:

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Re: True English

Message  MurielB le Dim 3 Déc - 20:57

Yes pronunciation is so important in the English language !

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Re: True English

Message  gerardM le Lun 18 Déc - 21:59

I often hesitate to write about it as it might not please the Brits, but I guess English language is mostly a copy of French language at a certain period of history.

It's sometimes funny/moving to realize there's a hidden old root...

Today I realized that
- the English "provided that..." corresponds to the French "pourvu que..."
- the English "provider" corresponds to the French "fournisseur"
Right?
Yes but...
- the French prefix "pour" is related to the Latin "pro", so it's not surprising that the French "pourvu" looks like the English "provided", is it?
- now tho we presently use "fournisseur", we've a synonym which is "pourvoyeur"...
- "pourvoyeur" looks very close to "provider", no?
Yes English is an old copy of French/a copy of old French.

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Re: True English

Message  MurielB le Lun 18 Déc - 22:17

Gérard I am not an expert but internet searching has told me that 45% of all English words have a French origin. It's amazing.

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Re: True English

Message  gerardM le Lun 18 Déc - 22:41

MurielB a écrit:Gérard I am not an expert but internet searching has told me that 45% of all English words have a French origin. It's amazing.
I'd have said more than 45%... scratch
I don't know if "have a French origin" means purely French and if "Latin origin" is not included in the number.
When I think of "looking like Fench", I mean "same root".


Dernière édition par gerardM le Lun 18 Déc - 22:46, édité 1 fois

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Re: True English

Message  MurielB le Lun 18 Déc - 22:43

Anyway as you said "English language is mostly a copy of French language" which is not a compliment for our friends across the Channel !

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Re: True English

Message  gerardM le Lun 18 Déc - 22:52

MurielB a écrit:Anyway as you said "English language is mostly a copy of French language" which is not a compliment for our friends across the Channel !
Is the word "copy" too harsh?
I'm not feeling disgraced to hear French comes after Latin, Greek or whatever.

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Re: True English

Message  MurielB le Lun 18 Déc - 23:01

Anyway all languages are descended from a proto-human language aren't they ?

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Re: True English

Message  gerardM le Lun 18 Déc - 23:13

MurielB a écrit:Anyway all languages are descended from a proto-human language aren't they ?
Some professionals say so... but there are oodles of ways and like in a family tree some languages are on the same branch, others no.


Dernière édition par gerardM le Mar 19 Déc - 11:07, édité 1 fois

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Re: True English

Message  MurielB le Lun 18 Déc - 23:28

I know you are a language evolution specialist and you must be right !

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Re: True English

Message  gerardM le Lun 25 Déc - 21:09

Howdy.
A few days ago, Nagui was receiving a candidate named Leith.
The guy was a Brit living in Corsica since the 1980s, I mean his French was very good.
Nagui told him that as far as he knew he had to pronounce "leeth" and Leith aknowledged.


That reminded me again (I guess I already write a few words about this) I had thought Cliff Richard that I liked as the singer of the Shadows ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX9AACWlk7I ) decades ago became the guitarist of the Rolling Stones.
scratch
The fact is that I heard several times the name of the guitarist of the Stones and that I heard "cliff Richard" but I've French ears. Wink
A problem was that when I was reading the names I couldn't find Cliff Richard among the Stones.

The truth is that the guitarist of the Stones is Keith Richards ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keith_Richards ) and that it is pronounced Keeth Richards.

Okayayayay! Embarassed

Good response by Mr Nagui whose wife is Engliish: "eith" is often/always pronounced "eeth".

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Re: True English

Message  gerardM le Lun 26 Fév - 23:32

Something I realized recently and that I forgot to say here.

In English, 1 is singular, 1.1 to 1.99 is plural, 2 is plural
In French, 1 is singular, 1.001 to 1.999 is singular, 2 is plural.
(I already wrote about this)

What I discovered is that in English, 0 is plural!!!
I don't know about 0,001 to 0,999 yet.

Something weird in English time:
- at the beginning of the "day", they write 0:10am (Fr minuit 10)
- for midday, the clock shows 12:10pm (Fr midi dix)
So for the afternoon, 12:10 is before 1:00.
Brits sometimes (eg in airports) write 0:10 or 12:10 without am nor pm; you now now howto make the distinction between am and pm - 12:01am doesn't exist, 0:01pm doesn't exist.

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Re: True English

Message  gerardM le Jeu 1 Mar - 23:58

Hi everyone,
I'm often thinking about posting this but never when I'm in front of my comp... here we are.

The English language has a pronunciation that is precise; I mean there're oodles of sounds that I cannot perceive.
My father was telling me: "To speak a good American, just fill your mouh with chewing gum". He was joking but I believed him: no it doesn't work, the pronunciation is not something anyone can imagine.
English speaking people hear so well that they have oodles of very close words.

A few examples around "Google"; I let you check the meanings:
- gaggle
- giggle
- goggle
- gogglles
(I just changes the second letter, I could have tried to also change others to find close/confusing pronunciations (for the French).

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